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I am trying to help a friend, he is looking for infor on his gt grandfather

John Read married Catherine Soper (born 1849 Jan) we think in the Bermondsey Area, around 1870.

Daugher Clara born 1879 (dec) we beleive her dad died shortly after as in the 1881 census Catherine is listed as a widow, she later married the lodger Robert Foxwell and Clara appears to of taken his name.

We think John died around 1879/80 but cannot find his death or the marriage, There we other children born before Clara

Clara was born in Bermondsey,

Any help you can offerwould be fantastic

Thanks

Jan x

Do you know when the oldest child was born?

Lesley

Could John have had another forename? There is this death in the same registration district as Catherine was living in the 1881 census:-

Name: Charles John Read
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1820
Year of Registration: 1879
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 59
District: St Olave Southwark (1837-1901)
County: London, Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 192

Kath. x

I'm not certain but I think this is Catherine Read in the 1881 census (she has a daughter Clara born at the right time):-

Name: Clara Read
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation: Daughter
Mother's Name: Catherine
Gender: Female
Where born: Rotherhithe, Surrey, England
Civil Parish: Rotherhithe
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 48 Parfitt Rd
Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Registration district: St Olave Southwark
Sub registration district: Rotherhithe
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age

Catherine Read 32
Ruth Read 9
Beatrice Read 4
Clara Read 1

Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 579; Folio: 114; Page: 57; Line: ; GSU roll: 1341132.

Kath. x

Hi Lesley

Ruth was 9 on the 1881 census and Beatrice was 4

Thank you

Hi Kathleen

Yes that is the right family for the census records, It is possible John had another name, most did, they don't like to make it easy for us.

That info is fantastic

Thank you so much,

If we can find the marriage e should be able to confirm the name, am I right

Thanks again

Jan x

Hi Jan

Have you got Clara's birth certificate...she might have been married before so would have used this name!

Lesley

I've looked for a marriage for both names (Charles John and Catherine and for John Read and Catherine) and can't find one to each other. There are a couple of marriages for the name Charles John Read in the London area but neither to Catherine Soper.

Kath. x

Just found Catherine's marriage to Robert Foxwell and she marries in the name of Catherine Soper.:-

Name: Catherine Soper
Year of Registration: 1892
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: St Saviour Southwark
County: London, Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 34

Spouse Robert Foxwell.


If she had been married to John Read her second marriage should have been in the name of Catherine Read.

Perhaps they never actually married.

Kath. x

Sorry Lesley

I haven't this is for a old school friend who now lives in Toronto, so just trying to help him out

Jan x

Hi Kathleen

Could I possible hve those detail, looks like they may not of married then,

Thank you for all your help

oops just seen it

Jan x

Thank you both for your fanatasic help, I have passed this on to James, but due to the time difference may not hear back tonight, but I know he will be delighted, so THANK YOU from him as well

Jan x

Does your friend have the birth certificate of Catherine Soper? It's just that you seem sure of when she was born.

I was wondering if Catherine's age on the 1881 census could be wrong? This is just a thought but there is this family on the 1871 census (but this Catherine would be too old to be yours if you are sure of her birth date):-

Name: Catherine Read
Age: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1829
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Charles J
Gender: Female
Where born: Surrey, England
Civil Parish: St Mary Newington
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation: Husband is a commercial traveller

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View Image
Registration district: St Saviour Southwark
Sub registration district: St Mary Newington
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 253
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles J Read 42
Catherine Read 42
Emma Read 30
Alfred Read 22
Edwin Read 17

Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 623; Folio: 24; Page: 41; GSU roll: 818922.

Kath. x

Oh Kath

You really are a gem

I dont have the cert but will pass ths onto James as he gave me the info but was unsure himself

Jan x

Do you know what

Condition of marriage means please

Disability

Jan x

Condition of marriage just means whether the person is single, married or widowed.

Disability is one of the columns on the census where something like, Blind, Deaf, Imbecile etc. would be written. There is nothing in this column on the census for your family.

On the 1871 census Charles J Read and Catherine are both described as married (although sometimes people said they were married when they weren't).

I am not sure now whether this IS the couple you are looking for as I have found this birth which might be the one your friend has:-

Name: Catherine Soper
Year of Registration: 1848
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: St Olave Southwark (1837-1901)
County: London, Surrey
Volume: 4
Page: 491

If this is the correct birth, then the couple in the 1871 census can't be yours.

Kath. x

I have just had another look at the 1881 census image for the family and realised that also living with them (although missed off the transcription), is:-

William Soper, head, widower, age 72, Tailor, born City of London, Middlesex
Richard Soper, son of above, age 14, Printer, born City of London.

I wonder if this is Catherine's father and brother?

If you would like a copy of this census image just send me a pm with your email address and I'll send it.

Kath. x

This is the family in 1891 (which confirms that William Soper is Catherine's father):-

Name: Beatrice Foxwell
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1877
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Robert
Mother's Name: Catherine
Gender: Female
Where born: Bermondsey, London, England
Civil Parish: St Paul Deptford
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
Town: Deptford
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street address: 54 Goodson Road

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Registration district: Greenwich
Sub registration district: St Paul Deptford
ED, institution, or vessel: 44
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age

Robert Foxwell 37, head, Lighterman on Barge, born Rotherhithe, London
Catherine Foxwell 41, wife
Beatrice Foxwell 14
Clara Foxwell 11
Annie Foxwell 7
Kate Foxwell 5
William Soper 82, wife's father, Tailor

Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 503; Folio 59; Page 109; GSU roll: 6095613.

I have saved this image too.

Kath. x

I think this is the family in 1901 (with Catherine being mistakenly entered as Kathleen):-

Name: Robert Foxwell
Age: 48
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Kathleen
Gender: Male
Where born: Bermondsey, London, England
Civil Parish: Deptford St Paul
Ecclesiastical parish: St Luke
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street address: 171 Trundley Street

Occupation: Lighterman on Barge

Condition as to marriage: married

Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Registration district: Greenwich
Sub registration district: Deptford, North
ED, institution, or vessel: 13
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 287
Household Members:
Name Age

Robert Foxwell 48
Kathleen Foxwell 50
Alfred G Foxwell 8

Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 525; Folio: 99; Page: 41.

Kath. x

Hi Kath

Yes that is the right birth for Catherine, just confirmed this with James.

So the 1871 census one isn't the right family.

William and Richard are her family by the looks of it,

So John and Catherine, may not of married but could of anytime after 1868 any anywhere in the country.

Bless them, glad they make life easy for us

Thank you

Jan x