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Unknown/Susan has this thread:

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1362169

as background.

hi I'm sorry not very good at this been contacted by estate research stating I'm a beneficay of an estate by ivy grace shepherd my grandad was horice william turner born west ham 1909 died new ham 1974 married elenor queen stanford my nan born 19/ 04/ died 03/01/ my granddads father was oswald william born mile end in 1883 i no he had 2 wives emily beck so I'm not sure if its my granddads child or my great grandad the estate researches won't tell me any more at this point

Hi there 'unknown'!
Welcome to he boards.
If you find after a while that Pete hasn't returned and seen your reply, I suggest you try sending a message by clicking on his name. As this thread is 2 years old he might not come looking for new replies..
Jan

hi pete my family are the turners i have found a criminal record for oswald turner henrys son and they lived in a poor area x

I suppose I will never know!!

thanks eveyone for your help

Pete :-S

Have you either of Henry's marriage certs, for his father's name?

In my tree I have an illegitimate man whose birth was registered under his MMN but appears on a later censuse as the son of the man his mother later married, with that man's surname. In later censuses he is sometimes under his MMN and sometimes the surname of his stepfather and uses the initial of the other surname as his middle initial.

Have you found Henry on a census pre 1881?

I had this happen to somebody I was helping sometime ago. The family appeared on 1st census as (say) Bloggs, on the next two or three as (say) Smith, on final census widow reverts to Bloggs but this family registered all the children as Bloggs!

We never did figure out why!

Sometimes this happened :)

In one family known to me, sometimes the surname is Paxman, sometimes Girling.

yes
in 1871 they lived at Eagle street in st george in the martyr Henry Jnr living at home but Thomas is at his grand parents in Chertsey street Guildford James and Jane Linegar

Pete

Have you got the family in 1871?
In 1881 Thomas O Turner is 14, so he should be 4 in 1871, with Father Henry, (and Mother Emma?)
Thanks

Children different?

I think he married a Emma lingar in 1865 then Mary Ann Pearson in 1874

Have you got marriage and birth certificates for them, and, if so, is there any use of Owen in them?
This happened with one of my families, but the husband had died, and the wife used his middle name as a surname in the census, then back to his proper surname in the next census.

Son Thomas aged 14 in 1881.
Mother aged 28

Did Henry marry twice ?

Yes they are all and one the same
They turn up again in 1901 as The Turner family!!
I am now going to bed and will do and will try to research a bit more tomorrow
thanks everyone for your help

Just to be clear, are these the 2 families in question? Not sure I have the right 1891 family?

1881 England Census

Name: Henry O. Turner
Age: 37
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1844
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary O. Turner
Gender: Male
Where born: Middlesex, England

Civil parish: Clerkenwell
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address: 101 Rosoman St (Public House)
Condition as to marriage: Married

Occupation: Publican

Registration district: Holborn
Sub-registration district: Amwell

Henry O. Turner 37
Mary O. Turner 28
Thomas O. Turner 14
Emma O. Turner 9
Isabella O. Turner 7
Ernest O. Turner 5
Olive O. Turner 3
Grace J. Parson 33


1891 England Census

Name: Henry Owen
Age: 45
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1846
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary Ann Owen
Gender: Male
Where born: N, London, England

Civil parish: Hackney
Ecclesiastical parish: St Barnabas
County/Island: London

Registration district: Hackney
Sub-registration district: Hackney

Henry Owen 45 (fish dealer)
Mary Ann Owen 38
Cleve Owen 12 (Olive)
Jessie Owen 10
Minnie Owen 9
Oswald Owen 7
Horace Wm Owen 5
Albert Victor Owen 3
William John Owen 7/12
Edward Benstead 46

Running from the rent man perhaps

Brummiejan,
You beat us to that suggestion.

Could be but there is no mention of Owen before this time on any records?

Might the O stand for Owen do you think?
Jan