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The David Bowman from Carlisle St. Mary Within is the one that keeps on coming up as being "the one". However I have my doubts. Could both father and son have the same names and one went by their middle name and the other by their first. Just a thought. James always calls himself James so I doubt I will find him under a "nick name". My mother thought that he came from "up north". My mother knew very little of her family, her mother died when she was six and she lived with her aunt until the early 1930s, then lived with her father and stepmother Annie briefly but Annie died in 1935 and my mother went into "service" as she used to say. I think that this was in Liverpool. Just another thought could he have had an earlier marriage than 1915. Could he have been a soldier,On the 1929 marriage licence it has him as Marine engineer/shipyard.My father was a stevedore on Birkenhead Docks perhaps this is how my mother and he met. Just thoughts that I chase. Thank you to all you lovely people

It's very confusing having three threads about the same man - this one and the two to which Chris posted links today at 08:14.

Most of the suggestions on here have already been made in the other two threads.

This is reportedly David according to a tree on ancestry. I assume this is the one you have reservations about?



1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription

13, East Tower Street, Carlisle St Mary Within, Carlisle, Cumberland, England




Sarah Bowman Head Widow Female 51 1830 No Occupation Longtown, Cumberland, England
George Bowman Son Single Male 26 1855 Assistant In Flour Shop (Dealer) Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Thomas Bowman Son Single Male 22 1859 Baker Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Richard Bowman Son Single Male 20 1861 Tailor Carlisle, Cumberland, England
David Bowman Son Single Male 18 1863 Stone Mason Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Robert Bowman Son Single Male 16 1865 Printer Compositor Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Sarah Bowman Daughter Single Female 14 1867 Scholar Carlisle, Cumberland, England

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

From the tree


Spouse & Children of David Bowman


Jane Deary
1862–


James Bowman 1888–1938

Richard Bell Bowman 1890–

Margaret Bowman 1892–


EDIT The David who married Jane appears to become a barman from 1891 and his son born 1888 is John E not James.

On the 1915 marriage it was Joseph and Sarah Ellison. Sarah was Ethel Bowmans sister. On the 1929 marriage it was Elizabeth Connor and Thomas Allan Sumner. Sumner being Annie Spongs birth name. On the 1938 marriage it was Dorotheas sisters Emily and Elsie Martin.

Who were the witnesses to the marriages? Any possible relatives?

I have all marriage certificates. On the 1915 it appears that David (the father) is alive. On the 1929 and 1938 it says he is deceased. So David must have passed away between 1916 and 1929.They all say that David is a stonemason. James is always said to be either an engine fitter or an engineers fitter.

I have all marriage certificates. On the 1915 it appears that David (the father) is alive. On the 1929 and 1938 it says he is deceased. So David must have passed away between 1916 and 1929.They all say that David is a stonemason. James is always said to be either an engine fitter or an engineers fitter.

David's occupation was Linen Loom Mechanic in 1901..........

David Bowman in the 1901 Scotland Census
Name: David Bowman
Age: 50
Estimated birth year: abt 1851
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Janet Bowman
Gender: Male
Where born: Dunfermline, Fife
Registration Number: 424
Registration district: Dunfermline
Civil Parish: Dunfermline
Town: Dunfermline
County: Fife
Address: 64 Golfdrum St
Occupation: Linen Loom Mechanic

Household Members:

David Bowman 50
Janet Bowman 50
Euphemia Bowman 20
James Bowman 79

According to Dorothy's other thread........David was a Stonemason.

No, forget that - he died in 1918:

1918 BOWMAN JAMES FOTHERING M 36 DUNFERMLINE /FIFE 424/00 0461

In 1891 the only James Bowman of the right age, living with father David, in the whole of UK & Ireland, is one who died in 1916.
I suppose your James's father could have died when James was a baby - which would be no help from our point of view.
Do you know if David was still alive in 1915?

Or
as a wild possibility, there's this one, whose family is listed as Bowman in 1881 and 1901:

James F Beaumont
in the 1891 Scotland Census
Name: James F Beaumont
[James F Bowman]
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: abt 1882
Relationship: Son
Father's name: David Beaumont
Mother's name: Janet Beaumont
Gender: Male
Where born: Dunfermline, Fife
Registration Number: 424
Registration district: Dunfermline
Civil Parish: Dunfermline
Town: Dunfermline
County: Fife
Address: 64 Golfdrum
Occupation: Scholar
ED: 20
Household schedule number: 56
LINE: 21
Roll: CSSCT1891_129
Household Members:
Name Age
David Beaumont 40
Janet Beaumont 42
Adam Beaumont 16
Euph H Beaumont 10
James F Beaumont 9

and his birth record says Bowman:

James Fotheringham Bowman
in the Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950
Name: James Fotheringham Bowman
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 25 Mar 1882
Baptism Date: 16 Apr 1882
Baptism Place: Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland
Father: David Bowman
Mother: Janet Fotheringham
FHL Film Number: 889489
Reference ID: CH2/641/3


So far, I haven't found him after 1891.

He doesn't appear to have been living in Cheshire in 1911 - though that's still 4 years away from the first marriage.
The only James Bowman of the right age in Cheshire in 1911 was born 1882 Liverpool, and was already married to a wife who didn't die until 1963.

His death was also in Cheshire:

Deaths Jun 1938 (>99%)
BOWMAN James 55 Wallasey 8a 670

Did any of his marriage certificates give an occupation for his father please?

Can you tell us James's occupation please? That may help us to identify him on the 1911 census.

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1152518

(think above might relate)


edits (also)

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1321688


http://talkingscot.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=532

Chris :)


Dorothy Report 20 May 2009 02:29

James was born 1883 in Carlisle,Cumbria(so we believe) to David Bowman. He wed an Ethel Diamond in 1915 and had 2 children Arthur Robert and Ethel. I am a child of Ethel. He wed again in 1929 and in 1938 he wed Dorothea Martin. He committed suicide in April 1938. Does anyone have any info on James or David prior to 1915. Thanks

For helpers' info - all marriages in Birkenhead area:

Marriages Dec 1915 (>99%)
Bowman James Diamond Birkenhead 8a 1166
Diamond Ethel Bowman Birkenhead 8a 1166

Marriages Dec 1929 (>99%)
Bowman James Spong Birkenhead 8a 1164
Spong Annie Bowman Birkenhead 8a 1164

Marriages Mar 1938 (>99%)
Bowman James Martin Wallasey 8a 1014
Martin Dorothea Bowman Wallasey 8a 1014

Hi Dorothy

How do you know his fathers name was David?

Do you have a copy of any of his marriage certificates?

This mans birth eludes me. Have three marriages, births of kids and his death but where did he come from. I was directed to a family in Carlisle but I doubt this is his.Can anyone suggest what way to go? James said to be born 1883, father was David, wife no.1 Ethel Diamond wed 1915.Wife no, 2 Annie Spong wed 1929. wife no. 3 Dorothea Martin wed 1938. I am a descendant of James and Ethel, fast approaching 80 years old and it would be so good to finally locate James' birth.
Any ideas about how to go about making headway would be great.
Thanks for your ear.
Dorothy